Good afternoon. Welcome to PCI's webinar series. This presentation is Efficiency, Labor and Automation and sponsored by Ultraspan. My name is Royce Covington, Manager of Member Services at PCI and I'll be your moderator for this session. Before I turn the controls over to your presenter today, I have a few introductory items to note. Earlier today we sent an email to all registered attendees with a handout of today's presentation. That handout has been updated and is available now and can be found in the handouts pane located near the bottom of the GoToWebinar toolbox. If you do not have the course handout, please email pcimarketing at marketing at pci.org as shown on your screen. Note that all attendee lines are muted. The GoToWebinar toolbox has an area for you to raise your hand. If you raise your hand, you will receive a private chat message from me. If you have a question, type it into the questions pane where I will be keeping track of them to read during the Q&A period. Today's presentation will be recorded and uploaded to PCI's LMS website within the next week. PCI is a registered provider of AIA CES, but this presentation is non-CEU and does not contain content that is endorsed by AIA. Any questions about the content of this webinar should be directed to PCI. The program content does not constitute approval by PCI, nor does it necessarily reflect the views or positions of PCI or those of their respective officers, directors, members, or employees. Questions related to specific products or publications will be addressed at the end of the presentation. Our presenter for today is Judy Dammeltchuk. Judy is an experienced business professional with expertise in operations, finance, and business strategy and execution. She has been with Ultraspan for over 20 years, many of those years leading initiatives on efficiencies, cost savings, lean manufacturing, Six Sigma, and other activities that drive operational excellence. As part of her role as general manager, she leads the business performance team in charge of finding solutions that deliver quantifiable results to precast producers. As an advisory board member of the Manufacturers Association and serving on the board of various organizations, she's passionate about other businesses and thrives on their success. I'll now turn the controls over so that we can begin our presentation. Hello, everyone. Thank you for joining us today. I want to thank all who attended our last webinar for joining us again today and for those who are here for the first time. Thank you and I trust you will find the information valuable. It is my pleasure to be presenting today and I am really excited to share our findings with you. So, let's get started. First, a brief introduction to our company. Ultraspan is right here in North America with offices in Winnipeg, Canada. We are part of the Progress Group out of Europe. We have several manufacturing plants, service centers and local presence across the globe. Our experience extends to over 55 years of continued support to more than 500 plants worldwide. Innovative technology and a unique in-house R&D precast facility in Europe have contributed to position Progress Group as the leading supplier of technology for the precast concrete industry. In terms of numbers, we're the number one machinery supplier in the industry with over 250 million in sales, over 640 employees and customers across 76 countries. Today, we're going to talk about North America, specifically US and Canada from our local headquarters in Winnipeg. Here, a quick reference of some of the projects we've had the honor of supporting worldwide. A complete precast plant in Thailand, a hollow core plant in Belgium and a double wall plant in Germany and of course, over 50 plants in North America. The objectives of the webinar today are to one, show how to identify specific areas and processes that have the highest potential for efficiency gains with automation. Two, explore some of the best solutions for capitalizing on that potential. And three, we will analyze the impact of automation for your operations. The overall goal of this presentation is to show you where and how you can implement automation to maximize your plant efficiency and operational profitability. Before we move ahead, just a reminder that a link to this presentation will be made available to all attendees. And please remember to send in your questions. I have a panel ready for questions. So I appreciate and encourage you to look for areas during the presentation to provide feedback, comments or questions. And I look forward to a great Q&A session. Today, we'll look at industrial manufacturing, the outlook, what are other industries doing and share with you what precast looks like around the world. Identification of low hanging fruit, the simple and obvious value leaks that can be quickly recaptured. Leveraging technology, ways in which technology can be implemented to capture this low hanging fruit. What's it worth to you? Basically, what is the nutritional value of capturing this fruit for your company? And we'll get to questions. We have our award-winning technical team standing by to answer any questions you may have. Also, later in the presentation, Jason Fitzwilliam will be joining us to share some of his expertise. And he will also be part of the Q&A session at the end. So let's start with industrial manufacturing. What are some current stats on labor? Less than 9% of the workforce currently in construction and manufacturing are under the age of 25. And more than 25% of employees are over the age of 50. There has been limited inflows of labor, and the aging workforce can't stay forever. Something is going to have to give. On top of this, training is becoming a larger and larger drain on profits as new employees lack the basic skills necessary to perform the tasks right out of the gate. The average annual training budget for small companies, again, small companies, is $308,000. Let that sink in for a bit. Companies are paying on average $308,000 just to train their new employees to a satisfactory level. And when an employee leaves, the cost to replace that one person is around 20% of their annual wage. I know about that, and I feel it as much as you do. Turnover is a reality. Think about the level of turnover you have experienced in the last years. Can you estimate the cost of their replacement? I'm sure this isn't news for most of you. When we visit producers, the number one issue that many face is with labor. Luckily, this isn't a new phenomenon. Other industries and other countries have gone through the same findings. Here, we'll briefly touch on a couple. The automobile industry, the originators of the assembly line, once heralded as the pinnacle of efficiency, has seen massive disruption with new manufacturing methods. What changed? Here's what a new automobile plant looks like today. When we look at efficiency in car manufacturing, we typically look at labor hours per vehicle. In the 80s, General Motors had the best results at 40 total labor hours per vehicle. In the last decade, other car manufacturers have eclipsed this with results less than 30 hours per vehicle. And this number continues to decrease as automation produces greater and greater efficiency gains. The automobile industry is well known for its automation, but they are not the only ones leaning into automation. Who else is leaning into automation? Is automation only for those producing standard products? Let's keep going. The lumber industry. Lumber production is now an automated system, churning out piece after piece of precision crafted kindling. Remember this? How many of us need to explain the concept of renting a video to our kids or younger members of our family? It seems like just yesterday that we could peruse the aisles of a blockbuster to find our next favorite movie. Which brings us to the precast in North America and how it may have to change. Fortunately, we aren't the first in precast to encounter this problem. Europe and other regions have gone through this already, and that's what we would like to share with you. A vision of what can be. I would like to introduce you to Prooxa. Prooxa is a developer, realtor, precaster and construction company that has vertically integrated through the use of technology and automation to deliver complete precast solutions. Current annual revenue is over $950 million, with a goal of 18% net margin and annual revenue growth of 25%. In their newest well panel plant, they are capable of producing 27,000 square feet of product per shift with a labor force of 25 people. So how do these precast markets differ? Let's start with plant size. North American plants average 54 employees compared to only 21 employees in Europe. Imagine what being able to reduce your labor force by over 50% could do for you. And let's look at total precast sales. North America has 5.7 billion of precast sales in 2019, and Europe at 40 billion of precast sales in 2019. The precast market in Europe is over seven times larger. This just highlights the huge potential that precast has for growth in North America. So how can we win? As found in NPCA's benchmarking report, high profit precasters are spending less on labor and have lower operating expenses. These are the two major elements. So we know what we have to do. Now let's get into how we can do it. We will focus on how to identify areas in the production of hollow core, wall panel and double T to find low hanging fruit. Although the products are completely different, the production methods and hence the pains and solutions are very similar. In a previous webinar we use this familiar product with the acronym CLR to highlight the three main elements that contribute to productivity leaks. C for cycle time, L for labor and R for rework. In that same webinar, we also highlighted that the processes with the highest value leaks are preparation, layout, casting and finishing. By using the three elements of CLR and considering these four processes, this is where you can find your fruit. So let's get into the harvest. Let's look at preparation. When we say preparation, what specific processes are we looking at? It's different for each product but does have some similar elements. So first, let's start with cleaning, oiling and pulling. For hollow core, preparation involves these three, cleaning the beds, oiling and strand pulling. In wall panel production, preparation also involves cleaning the beds, oiling, strand pulling and in addition reinforcement setting of bulkheads and insulation cutting. For double T, preparation involves cleaning, oiling, strand pulling, reinforcement and bulkheads. Do you see a pattern? Next, let's look at layout. Layout for hollow core, wall panel and double T all involve marking and they all involve measuring. What are some of the pains and labor issues of layout? For instance, what is 16 3 8 minus 7 11 16? Now most of the veterans can quickly and accurately make the right calculation on the spot. But what about new crew members? And can you expect that the result of this manual calculation will be the same Monday morning as it is on Friday afternoon? Let's look at casting. Concrete delivery is a process across all three products. Concrete distribution is a process for wall panel and double T. And in hollow core, cutouts and embeds are a time consuming process. And next, let's look at finishing. Both tarping and finishing are processes across hollow core, wall panel and double T production. So, leveraging technology. What is available to make these processes more efficient? I have asked Jason Fitzwilliam to join us and share information on technology that is available and what he has seen in his many visits to precast plants. Jason is a structural engineer and fellow NPCA master precaster. So, thank you for joining us, Jason. And as preparation was the first process we highlighted, can you share some of what you have found and your experiences in the industry? Sure, Judy. Thank you. And thanks to all the attendees on this webinar for listening in today. So, let's jump right in looking at ways to leverage technology in the preparation stage of production. All three of the units for cleaning, oiling and pulling for hollow core, wall panel and double T function very similar to each other. To clean the casting surface, they incorporate a leading edge scraper blade to loosen and clear concrete debris and scale, while the rotating brushes sweep up the finer particles, dust and debris. The double T unit uses two adjustment or two adjustable vertical brushes to clean the stems along with the casting surface. Once the bed is cleaned, the rotating oiling nozzle spray release agent onto the casting surface in a consistent mist and at a constant pressure, ensuring that even application and consistent results are achieved. And finally, pulling or towing of strands. All of the units have the capability to pull multiple strands simultaneously down the length of the bed from one end to the other, further reducing cycle times and labor requirements. So, let's look at the benefits. For this analysis, our team looked at real world production facilities for hollow core, wall panel and double T case studies, if you will. For hollow core, we chose a standard operation with two 500 foot long beds, wall panel operations with two beds, each 200 feet long and double T operation with a single bed 500 feet in length. With the implementation of a cleaning, oiling and pulling solution, the producer had a reduction in cycle time of approximately one and a half hours and was able to reduce production labor input by approximately $40,000 per year. The result is a payback of the investment of under two years on the project. This example investigates only hollow core, while we have seen very similar results for both wall panel and double T due to the similarity in the production processes. In addition to the CLR savings shown here, producers are seeing the added benefits of improved health and safety by minimizing some of the most physically demanding processes in production. Increased employee retention for the same reasons obviously would be an added benefit as well. Improved product quality through a much cleaner casting surface and overall increase in plant cleanliness are also added benefits. Let's take a look at leveraging technology in the area of insulation cutting, which is also a part of preparation. In sandwich panel production, insulation cutting can be one of the most tedious tasks. The automated insulation cutter simplifies the entire process using a high pressure water jet cutting system. It reads information directly from the CAD system and drawings to perfectly cut each piece of insulation to the exact size and shape. It is capable of straight, diagonal and even curved or circular cuts. Through the optimization algorithms available, material savings can also be realized. It's easy because all you do is transfer the drawings for the day's production into the insulation cutter and it will produce all of the pieces that you need in a fraction of the time using only a single operator for loading and unloading. Let's look at the benefits of this as well. So in this case, we had a producer that we've been working with, with two employees cutting insulation each day. With the addition of the insulation cutter, he was able to relocate those employees to much higher value positions in his production process, saving approximately $90,000 in labor for the year. With computer optimization, they were also able to reduce their total insulation costs by approximately $58,000 due to the reduced waste and purchasing in much larger, more efficient sizes. This provided a CAPEX payback of about 1.6 years and added to these benefits is the increased health and safety, no more saws, standing in one place for extended periods of time, etc. and cutting at last minute intervals on the form itself. Obviously, it resulted in a cleaner plant as water jet cutting eliminates all of the dust and shavings and it makes a much cleaner cut. Additional benefits to scheduling through just-in-time production are also a common benefit as well. So let's move on and look at reinforcement, shuttering and bulkhead placement or solutions. So in this case, we're looking at a multifunctional trolley or MFT for short. It is a multipurpose production support system to assist work crews by providing consumable items and services directly on the production line where it matters the most. No more walking around and looking for what you need, basically. The MFT is intended to assist in the most critical phase of the cycle, which is bed preparation. It provides assistance with options for placing, removing, storing and cleaning of shutters, towing of strand, tool and consumable storage, options for compressed air, hot glue, light lifting tackle and even vacuum if required. Looking at the savings and cost benefit analysis for the typical wall panel producers that we've seen, they were able to reduce their total preparation time by about two hours each day with the MFT, an overall labour reduction in about $120,000 with approximately a 1.3 year payback period. The MFT also provided numerous health and safety benefits, better plant space utilization and an overall reduction in wasted movement, which all led to increased employee retention and satisfaction in the end. Let's move on to look at layout. And by layout, what we mean is marking and measuring solutions on the production surface itself. All of the production plotters quickly and accurately transfer layout geometry from the CAD model to the casting surface of the production bed, or in the case of Holocore, onto the fresh concrete of the recently cast slab. This is a unilateral solution, which applies obviously to Holocore, wall panel and double T, as they all will require some measure of layout in the production cycle. Essentially, environmentally friendly marking paint is jetted onto the working surface in both X and Y axes with a precision plotting head, much like the printer head in your desk jet printer at home. And it is suspended over the production bed to produce the ink flow onto the product. For the Holocore unit, there is an additional printing head or a series of heads, which we'll also mark on the sides of the slab as well. Typical side printing will include the job and piece numbers, weight of the piece, length, and you can even add your logo if you wish. So looking at the benefits in our example, with the Holocore implementation, the plant was able to recapture about $47,000 in annual labor cost and a reduction of rework and waste of about $18,000. The really interesting thing was that labor savings came from slightly unexpected sources. For instance, it improved the yarding, shipping, and installation processes by having the correct job and piece number written legibly on the side of the slab. This virtually eliminated mix-ups in handling and in the yard and on site as well. No more time wasted verifying or determining the piece number. Additional benefits included health and safety, not having an employee slumped over a Holocore slab anymore, increased accuracy and fit on site, and value-added resource allocation. When we say that, what we mean is that we were able to take the highest skilled employees off of the layout and allow them to run the entire team to gain further efficiencies. In wall panel, similarly, we saw very beneficial results. With wall panel plotting, we're actually able to reduce cycle time by about an hour in our case, as layout is required before all other processes can commence. Additionally, with this reduced time and reallocation of human capital, they were able to save approximately $43,000 in labor and an amazing $45,000 approximately in rework and waste, providing them with approximately a two-year payback. Additional benefits are very similar to Holocore, with the largest being the ability to have your team leaders focused on being leaders instead of measuring and actually working physically on the production bed. Let's take a look at casting. The concrete delivery system, or more widely referred to as a flying bucket, automatically delivers concrete from the batching plant to the production area where and when it is needed. This greatly increases casting efficiency with faster concrete delivery while eliminating labor and the hazards of additional machinery on the production floor. Looking at the benefits. For one of our producers, a solution such as this was able to reduce their cycle time by one hour simply by being able to get the concrete where it was needed and at the precise time it was needed as well. They were able to reduce labor by approximately $65,000 per year and completely pay back their investment in about 3.8 years. With concrete delivery out of the way, they increased the plant health and safety and were able to recapture valuable production floor space with the need for machinery runways and could more efficiently allocate their resources on a daily basis. They were also able to eliminate the maintenance and upkeep on their aging vehicular delivery systems. As a part of casting, especially for Holocore, let's have a look here at the aspirator. So one of the most, if not the most difficult and disliked task in Holocore production, especially nowadays, is the removal of concrete from the produced slab or the fresh concrete for cutouts and embeds. This is typically the starting position for most new Holocore employees and usually leads to a high rate of attrition. To solve this, we have the Holocore aspirator, which is a water jet cutter and vacuum suction system designed to remove the concrete from the fresh concrete in the slab. It can be used to remove concrete from slots, cutouts, openings, and can even be used to clean the space along the rails. Let's look at the benefits. The largest savings with the implementation of the aspirator comes from direct labor savings. Depending on the level of complexity in the Holocore bed, there could be three or more employees solely responsible for performing these tasks. These can be eliminated or reduced or redistributed within the production and can provide upwards of $37,000 in annual savings. Additionally, with the increased accuracy, there is a reduction in total rework costs of approximately 9,000 per year. However, the largest gains are from workers by eliminating the most difficult and tedious tasks in the plant. Employee retention and satisfaction soars and healthy and happy employees make the best employees. Moving on to casting. So for simplification and increased efficiency in casting, especially for wall panels, concrete distributors are your number one choice. They're used to uniformly cast fresh concrete into the shuttered production bed by a series of precisely actuated discharge gates and slides. Concrete is advanced evenly into the gates by the rotary feeders while discharge gates provide both a high degree of flexibility and accuracy in the concrete placement. So essentially the concrete is always placed exactly where it needs to be in the mold. Looking at the cost benefit analysis, with the increased speed and accuracy of the concrete distribution system into the shuttered production bed, producers can reduce their cycle time by approximately one hour and require a fraction of the labor. Labor that is presently used to manually move the concrete into the correct position can be reallocated into different parts of the production in the plant, which represents an annual savings of approximately $200,000 and an equipment payback of about three years. Implementation of a concrete distributor also leads to increased health and safety standards with employees no longer having to shovel and move concrete around on an elevated bed. Reduced concrete waste is also a large benefit to this as well. And finally, let's move on to finishing, which is the final phase of production. So let's look at one of the most basic and necessary tasks, which is tarping. Though simple, there is still availability to increase efficiency and produce measurable savings with a simple to use tarp roller system. As the name entails, the tarp roller executes convenient and fast tarping of the product for easy operations. With a tarp rolling system, if we look at the benefits, it's actually possible to reduce your overall cycle time by as much as half an hour within a typical plant. And this could be approximately 8,000 or $9,000 in annual savings. This may not sound like a huge substantial gain, but with such a small investment, you're looking at a short payback time of just about a year. On top of the quick return, the tarp roller simplifies the process, leading to increased employee satisfaction and eliminating the requirement of moving large, heavy, awkward tarps around the plant. And finally, with finishing, depending on the type of production that's being done for wall paneling or double T, there may be a requirement to hard trowel the surface. In this case, traditionally these are done with walk behind trowel machines, but luckily for us, we have the option of using these types of power trowels, which you see here. These are available for both wall panel and double T. The power trowel uses a horizontally rotating trowel head to float and smooth the surface of the fresh concrete after the initial set has taken place. With control of both the horizontal and vertical axes, as well as a rotational speed, the operator can make adjustments to ensure a perfect finish every time. Additional options are available to turn the power trowel into a complete finishing machine, adding some options such as a leveling beam, rake and broom finishing, and multiple trowel heads to increase finishing speed are also options. With solutions such as these, if we look at the benefits, we can see that with the increased speed of a full portal or gantry style troweling machine, overall finishing time can be reduced by as much as two hours, providing annual labor savings of approximately $46,000 and a capital expenditure payback of about two and a half years. When we look at the additional benefits, we have, as always, health and safety as a primary focus. With a finishing machine, you no longer need an employee standing on top of a bed, maneuvering a heavy, awkward piece of equipment. I'm sure that everyone has seen at least one video of a troweling machine getting away. I know I have, that's for sure. And with that, I'll turn it back over to Judy to continue the presentation. Thank you, Jason, for sharing these real-life examples of how to leverage technology. So what's it worth to you? Based on these real-life examples, if we calculate all of the savings from the solutions that we looked at for Holocore, here we see the total savings. Cycle time of three hours, labor of over $226,000, rework savings over 27,000, and a payback just over three years. Looking at WallPanel, based on the real-world examples, if we calculate all of the savings from the solutions that we looked at for WallPanel, the total savings include cycle time, eight hours, labor over $538,000, rework savings over $45,000, material savings over $57,000, and a payback just over two years. And based on the DoubleT examples, if we calculate all of the savings from the solutions that we looked at for DoubleT, here we find the total savings of cycle time of five and a half hours, labor, almost $200,000, rework of $15,000, and a payback of two years. Well, we've gone through a lot of information in the last minutes. How can we make a difference? And where to start? I just want to share a quick example. Stebby's Precast, one of the leading producers, is focusing on Total Precast. They identified that layout was a critical success factor to reduce their operating costs. Today, they have an unmanned layout operation, and it took less than five months to make the difference. An article about this is in the October edition of Concrete Products. So this can be simpler than it looks. All I would like to ask you today is to pick a process that's right for efficiency improvements and call us. We'd be delighted to help you and your team. Which process? Just look around and note areas where you see a lot of people, or tape measures being used, or a product that needs a lot of customization. That's a good indicator that you're on the money. So grab that fruit and call us. So thank you for your time. I hope you found some inspiration to continue working on your plant efficiencies or contribution to increase your bottom line, which ultimately makes your life and the life of those around you more productive and easier. If we can contribute to improve both, we've accomplished our mission. Thank you. Thank you, Judy, and thank you, Jason. We are now at the Q&A portion, portion of our presentation, and we've got a couple of questions already. The first one is, when you incorporate automation in your plant, does it need high-skill labor that is more challenging to get? That's a good question. I'll answer it. So precisely implementing automation takes control of the activities that require high-skill labor, diversifying the risk in your operation. That means layout and detailing or detailing processes. Now your process does not rely 100% on skilled labor personnel, while you improve efficiency and productivity across the board. You can train as many workers as you need for new technology at the start, or even during regular operation. All right, we just got a new question in. It says, how do you provide a sense of job security to current employees when automation significantly reduces the labor force? Okay, I can answer that. So it's not about reducing the labor force necessarily, it's about making it more efficient. So you'll notice that we talked a lot about reallocation. So employees can basically be retrained to do other tasks that are more efficient and more adapted to their specialties in the organization, and they can be promoted to other parts of the processes where they can lead the process. So I look at it more as a transitional promotion of employees rather than a displacement. Okay, thank you. That goes with this next question. Which process do you recommend to automate first? So in general, we see machines that require less precision, which would typically mean cleaning machines, oiling machines, pulling machines, for example, as the simplest to automate because of the low level of technology. Furthermore, processes such as that are typically very labor-intensive and the least safe. So jobs that contribute to high amounts of rework typically require more engineering and time to design that can help cut out costly human error. So those would be the places that we look at first. Okay, thank you. We have a two-part question here. It's how many strands can the strand puller support and how many linear feet can it pull up to 11 strands simultaneously? Up to 11 strands simultaneously? Sorry. So that's a good question. I mean, it depends on what type of production process you're talking about. Typically, our machines, as they are designed currently, will pull between eight and 10 strands per trip. In terms of the distance, there's no problem pulling up to 500 feet without an issue, but obviously everyone has a different production situation so we can tailor to suit what's required. Awesome, thank you. The next one, I guess this is a two-part question. My production is so variable, our panels are never the same. Do you see a way to automate customized production? So customization is very important, especially in North America, in terms of looking at that parameter to determine if automation is feasible. So in almost all cases, customization that we find in our industry is related to changes in dimensions. When you look at it, you have two choices, a human empowered by a tape measure or a machine working from a CAD file. In that case, we can't compete with machines. You can throw a machine at different panels all day long and they won't even notice it. It'll produce an accurate result every time. So from that perspective, I'd say that customization is in fact an indicator that we should look at automation in our processes. And I'd love to discuss this in detail and the specifics. If you'd really like to pursue this any further, you can give us a call and we'd love to discuss it. Okay, thank you. Next question that came in says, how will we find out more detail about the wall panel production process? Do you provide an online video? So Judy, maybe you can answer this one. We do have videos and information that we can certainly share. Whoever's asking, we have a team that are ready for questions and to provide resources and reference information. So our number will be provided at the end. And we definitely would love to share that information with you. Okay. Next question is, how do we find out about the wall panel production process? Do you provide an online video? Okay, so that's a good question. So we do have a team that are ready for questions and to provide resources and information about the wall panel production process. So our number will be provided at the end. And we definitely would love to share that information with you. Next question is, how does the machine handle projects and articulations for angled or radius panels? The information, the contact information for the, you know, asking questions. Next question is, is it automation more suitable for repetitive tasks? The answer is sometimes, but not necessarily. I mean, it really depends on what type of production you're talking about. But typically we see the most returns in production processes where human beings are involved in either quality critical tasks or very difficult tasks that are easily done by a machine. So all the heavy lifting tasks would be where we would look at for automation. All right, thank you so much. Next question is, does automation entail significant upfront costs that can be prohibitive? So that's the part that, you know, we look into quite a lot, but basically you have to look at the cost and the benefit as well. So when you look at automation as a medium term investment for your organization, you have to weigh it against all the quality defects, the safety hazards and the risks and the workers' compensation claims. And then also the limited skilled labor challenge that we have in our industry today. And when you look at all those things, it seems like it's an easy decision. And we recommend doing the homework and we can help you do this for evaluating your process and other individual activities that might be, you know, special to your organization. And then quantifying all the costs associated with that, basically tying it back to the same CLR process that we alluded to in our previous webinar and also today. In some operations, we have found that the investment is recovered in less than a year with all the potential savings and recaptures that we see. As we've demonstrated today, it typically is between a year and three years. Excellent. Oh, we just got another question in. Is there a minimum size for the facility buildings for the machines required for the wall panel production process? The answer is not really. I mean, what we do is we focus on specific tasks within the production system. So you really just have to look at the space available to that task, not necessarily the whole thing, but of course, you know, if we're looking at a greenfield production facility, then we would have to look at that in terms of the ultimate goal for production values in terms of capacity, daily cycles, et cetera. So the answer is it depends. And if they have a specific need, we can more than definitely look at it for them. Okay. Well, it looks like that's all the questions that we have today. So on behalf of PCI, I'd like to thank our presenters for the great presentation and all attendees for your participation. If you have any further questions, you can reach out to Ultraspan directly here for more resources. It looks like we have, I'm sorry, we have a bit of time for a little bit more. We have one more question that just came in. It says, for the wall panels, is it possible to adapt for architectural finishes like liner, I think that's supposed to be linear, surfaces and in geometries that panels are not completely fit flat? So the answer is maybe, and it depends on the degree of complexity in that regard. So the answer is it is possible, but it would require a special attention. So if the participant would like, he can reach out to us and we can discuss further. All right, well, thank you, Judy. And thank you, Jason. All right, well, thank you, Judy. And thank you, Jason.

Efficiency

Labor

Automation

Ultraspan

Precast production

Savings

Technology solutions

Productivity